[Maximus3D]

Time to quit beating around the bush now Mike, you seem to know the truth. Then enlighten us with your knowledge about this issue now.

/ Max

[leoA4D]

NL, I am appealing to you to step in here and end this confusion and game playing. I am not interested in a mod with hurt feelings. I am concerned that this wounded mod is adding to the confusion and damage. Please do something now!

[noseman]

I wan't to place my thoughts on this matter too Mike.

1. When you buy a program (sw) you never get the full list of features written down.
There are so many combinations of features that can't be listed.
In M~R's feature list it doesn't say that you can save your rendering, but you can. It's part of the obvious stuff. I just read the features on the site and it doesn't say anything about saving.

2. My main concern is that sunlight and physical sky have 2 uses in archiviz. One for external renderings and one for internal.
Many architects I know make renderings of rooms lit at different times of the day with sun position accuracy. They need this light to be able to enter the room so that the real light conditions are simulated.

3. If I would use your argument "if it's not listed in the feature list don't buy it" please allow me to ask for what WAS listed. Can you deliver my version of M~R V1 with the announced features back in june 2005. That's why I preordered. That was listed in the feature list. No you can't.

4. If NL can't give us a working sunlight system that passes through glass I really don't care. I don't want one. But others do and I stand beside them.

As you can see from my posts I never rant about NL policy or M~R delay, but some things must be said.

P.S. I have nothing personal with you or any other member of this forum or NL. I am dissapointed but not angry. I am a patient person. Good luck to all.

edit:
by the time I wrote this, another 10 replies where written sorry for the repetition of some things

[seco7]

Buffos -

You are about 1 micron from getting it. I can just feel it. You and the other guys are totally right about it being a reasonable feature. You're right about it "should" being in there. I'm not arguing that for you guys who need this.. I'm talking about the very important gap between such assumptions, and all the hate.

If you really needed this feature, and saw the words "unbiased," I can see how you'd be hopeful. But you could've 1) asked first to be sure or 2) Purchased Maxwell on the "hope" that it would.

SO then you fire up Maxwell, it doesn't do this, and you write NL: Sorry, I was really hoping it did this, but it doesn't, and I need it. Refund, please.

That's a far cry from being promised something EVEN IF IT'S A REASONABLE FEATURE and then calling people ass*oles for months.

_Mike

I think Mike needs a group hug. Seriously, sorry Mike for all the hate ... I think everyone here knows that you do not work for NL and are not responsible for their actions (or lack thereof), we just forget sometimes because you are the only "official" to show your face.

Now answer the question please.

[mverta]

Ok.. guys and Frances, you too... look.

I don't care about this feature. I know you do. I don't think even ONE of you is making an unreasonable request or assumption about whether this should be in Maxwell or not.

I'm simply addressing the issue that it seems to be the justification for a lot of absolutely despicable behaviour, which I personally keep getting hit with, despite my never having done ANYTHING in hundreds of hours except try to help, help the development of Maxwell, stay up all night answering questions for the release of the first RC, go to bat for you guys with NL to get images released, and start a 20+ page thread answering question after question.

I'm personally a little bit tired of being called names, especially when the whole thing looks to be on pretty shaky ground from here.

I'm not playing games with you, and I'm not "painting myself into a corner," either. I'm taking my first opportunity in 20+ pages to ask you guys to just chil the f*ck out on me for one inning.

And Frances, as soon as you decide to stop bad mouthing me on other forums and be a stand-up woman about it, I'll happily answer your questions. I've never done anything to you. NOTHING. You can take the Darth Bleh stuff and shove it.

_Mike

[markps]

I think cosmicblobs has clipmaps too..

[mverta]

Adehus -

For the 8 bilionth time, you're not crazy for wanting it. You're not crazy for assuming it, or needing it. None of you are.

I'm asking about the justification for the hate stuff. You think my bringing this up makes things worse? I don't agree. I think this forum has demonstrated in the last week a tremendous capacity for change. I believe that we should be able to take stuff head on. I am willing to try, anyway, and so I've aksed the question of you.

_Mike

[rivoli]

anyway, i think this answers mike's question, it's the whole sunlight and glass story:

http://www.maxwellrender.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1720

[markps]

Mike,

The main problem.. is that you are the middle man. You are in the front line and NO ONE from NL had the courage to be in front here and answer some questions.

After almost a year of delays.. and weekly broken promisses it is looking more like a big joke with our money.

NL takes no responsibility.. and you are the only one that we can talk with.

Ok.. guys and Frances, you too... look.

I don't care about this feature. I know you do. I don't think even ONE of you is making an unreasonable request or assumption about whether this should be in Maxwell or not.

I'm simply addressing the issue that it seems to be the justification for a lot of absolutely despicable behaviour, which I personally keep getting hit with, despite my never having done ANYTHING in hundreds of hours except try to help, help the development of Maxwell, stay up all night answering questions for the release of the first RC, go to bat for you guys with NL to get images released, and start a 20+ page thread answering question after question.

I'm personally a little bit tired of being called names, especially when the whole thing looks to be on pretty shaky ground from here.

I'm not playing games with you, and I'm not "painting myself into a corner," either. I'm taking my first opportunity in 20+ pages to ask you guys to just chil the f*ck out on me for one inning.

And Frances, as soon as you decide to stop bad mouthing me on other forums and be a stand-up woman about it, I'll happily answer your questions. I've never done anything to you. NOTHING. You can take the Darth Bleh stuff and shove it.

_Mike

[seco7]

I think Mike needs a group hug. Seriously, sorry Mike for all the hate ... I think everyone here knows that you do not work for NL and are not responsible for their actions (or lack thereof), we just forget sometimes because you are the only "official" to show your face.

Now answer the question please.

I dunno man... the way he's handling this is worse than if he'd said nothing. He's trying to act like we're crazy for expecting Maxwell to do something that is clearly promised under the concept of physical accuracy and is also something that *every* other render app on the market can do. It's just utterly ridiculous.

It is rediculous, but Mike doesn't code for NL. Period. You might as well yell at anyone on this board about it because everyone has equal responsibility and influence ... none. As much as I dislike the way this ship is sinking, I cannot see blaming innocent bystanders for it.

As a side note, I'm using NL as an example in school (for my MBA) and not a good example at that. My worry is that my prof will never believe me.

[leoA4D]

Okay, NL, listen up. Mike is displaying signs of serious battle fatique and sorely needs R&R. He has earned a break so, please send in the next chump to take the hits for you.

[leoA4D]

i think we are all pretty tired.

Yes, and I think this is a ride none of us will ever forget. Crazy!

[paxreid]

Agree with Frances....

Maxwell coins it's existence as an 'unbiased' render.

Maxwell is a new render engine based on the physics of real light. Its algorithms and equations reproduce the behavior of light in a completely accurate way. All of the elements in Maxwell, such as light emitters, material shaders, cameras etc., are entirely based on physically accurate models.

If one would read this description of Maxwell...it is not an assumtion that the Light at Noon would be more intense than at dusk. We know these things because of empirical evidence and observation. When a program claims to be able to reproduce the effect of light in a 'completely accurate way', it changes from I assume it would be more intense...to 'based on the claims of physical accuracy, it would be an indictment on the program if it WASNT correct.'

This same logic would apply to the last sentance as well. 'all elements in Maxwell, such as light emitters, material shaders, cameras etc, are entirely based on physically accurate models'.

Either the glass materials represented by maxwell are based on physically accurate models or they are not. simple. Glass has physical properties that allow light to pass through. Just as we would expect an aluminum material to have physical properties 'entirely based on physical models'. I don't expect the aluminum shader to be transparant..nor wpuld I expect it in the feature list in order to validate is correctness.

Paxton

[dd_]

well im not sleepy but im confused
it just doesnt make sense

NL AS I HAVE TOLD TO ON NUMBEROUS THREADS TAKE AS LONG AS U NEED TO GET IT SORTED and be honest with us
we dont need the run a round we need good communications.

im done for the night , im sure i will be able to read more in the morning.
good night all and take care

[Frances]

And Frances, as soon as you decide to stop bad mouthing me on other forums and be a stand-up woman about it, I'll happily answer your questions. I've never done anything to you. NOTHING. You can take the Darth Bleh stuff and shove it.
_Mike

Anything I post on a public forum, I expect all the world to be able to see. Don't give us grand soliloquies about the Next Limit focus and how we don't matter and expect any warm fuzzies from the people who actually had the audacity to think they mattered.