[Bubbaloo]

Going to their offices to speak with accountants is one thing, but haven't you seen the footage of armed raids by the IRS where they bust into homes with assault rifles? They are like thugs or bullies demanding your lunch money. If you don't pay your taxes, they have absolute authority to raid your home/business to collect things of value. Then you go to prison. Like I said, thugs.

[JDHill]

How about just six examples that support your statement.

Very well, though I don't see the point in doing so -- as you are looking for examples, you may start by looking in the mirror. You are innocent, yet taxed under threat of force, no? If you comply, the threat is never realized and yet, this does not change the facts. Since you ask for more examples than one, I will then add myself, followed by my family, and then as far as I know, all of the people I tend to associate with. We are all, as I previously characterized, innocent citizens, and yet we all find ourselves under a very real and uninvited threat. I am not sure how to put this any more clearly.

[Hybaj]

Obama or McCain? Who cares... I would choose Chuck Baldwin (3rd party candidate) over both of them any time (or even Nader for christ sakes).

Even though John Stossel didn't really hit the head of the nail everytime with his "colorful" examples but the whole idea is there.. it's called freedom and less goverment.

Part 1 to 6

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Phs6Cwnu ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e11-_cE6 ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuL8teeu ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Pu6cT6I ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTI9r4pU ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWVLr8Y1 ... re=related

Sad but people are sheep and will never learn.. this is a funny vid about it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqpFm7zAK90

Choosing between Obama's scary socialism against scary Mccain foreign policy is like choosing between Satan and Belzebub. Both supported the idiotic bailout and all kinds of shiznit... groovy isn't it?

[jvanmetre]

Despite which side you are on or even if you didn't support any of the candidates...it was a historical election.

Politicians are on both sides...I was reminded of PJ Rourke's seminal political treatise, "Parliament of Whores", in which he said "Democrats are... the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller, and get the chickweed out of your lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then they get elected and prove it."

jvm

[leoA4D]

Hey JDHill. I was hoping for examples of government-sponsored charities that accomplish their objectives through the use of threats of violence. You listed those that consider themselves to be victims.

Hybaj, one should never takes seriously what a candidate says before an election, regardless of name, party, policies, etc.

"Sad but people are sheep and will never learn." It is easier to trust the person that offers some truth than to make an effort to demand or learn the whole truth. And the whole truth is not getting out anymore while the sources of the whole truth are nearing extinction.

[leoA4D]

"Democrats are... the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller, and get the chickweed out of your lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then they get elected and prove it."jvm

Good one!

[Hybaj]

leoA4D : Yes but I'd like to hear about what goverment is not going to do instead of what it's going to do (like save the freaking markets, crappy financial institutions & stuff).

Yes it's easier but I don't see much truth on McCain or Obama either So I guess it figures

Hooray for socialism

[leoA4D]

Hybaj, I listened to the first Stossel episode and three thoughts came to mind:
1/ Early on, Stossel asserts that Congress is the fault for the financial crisis. He omits the roles of industry and lobbyists.
2/ His primary source of information in that segment is the Cato Institute. Absurd!
3/ ABC-TV, producer of the 20/20 show, is owned by the conservative Walt Disney company which is one of about five companies that control the TV news we receive. To put it another way we have neither a free press nor investigative journalism. Jon Stossel is a news reader, an actor and an employee of ABC-TV.

[Hybaj]

Those are glitches my friend... just minor glitches.. the idea is what counts

When it comes to financial crisis I'm on the side of people who think it was a sole problem of the FED and goverment (low interest rate, goverment connection to f&f mae/mac > moral hazard). You know people have been greedy and stupid since the day one of the existence of human kind. Once you take away the fear of failing (personal bankrupcy due to not being able to pay mortgage payments, bailing out idiotic companies) people ussualy tend set their auto-pilots for suicide. Even when big companies failt that doesn't mean the whole free market idea fails.. it's just the company that fails and the system continues at a reasonable effeciency (yeah sometimes slight regulation can boost up the effectivity.. but rarely)

Yeah "everybody should own a house" my butt dear goverment.

Hey even Forbes on me with this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFxZDTAXEhg

So again.. people are stupid (companies are made up of people so...) and if you mess with the idea of failing everything explodes..

[JDHill]

I was hoping for examples of government-sponsored charities that accomplish their objectives through the use of threats of violence.

All of them. Obviously.

[leoA4D]

A glitch is a malfunction. Stossel's work is not a malfunction. On the contrary, it is having its intended effect. Also, you portray government as being on top of the pile. Not so.

Edit: Forbes is just pointing the finger towards government and protecting Wall Street, et al. Since the bail out, business has turned to all of its most potent weapons to protect the status quo. Everyone is on the wall, hand resting on the hilt.

[RonB]

I had no idea what my HOORAY would wrought...

[Frances]

So, our president-elect is a thug. Nice. Maybe you could spend some time figuring out the difference between entitlement and dignity. Or the difference between hand-out and help-out.

When you give, it is a help-out. When someone takes from you in order to give, it is a hand-out...

Since you feel under no obligation to pay taxes, I guess you do your own bridge maintenance. Do you watch TV? Say thanks to Uncle Sam. Does your county have clean water standards? Say thanks. Say thanks and pay up.

[daros]

W Obama! A peacefuller world is my wish.
In Italy, everybody knows that, we have a different kind of politicians ruling the country.
That's the reaction of our prime minister to the US elections:
http://www.repubblica.it/2006/05/galler ... oni/1.html

[Bubbaloo]

Paying taxes is absolutely necessary. But what is done with those taxes is the concern. When my taxes (hard earned money) goes to help out illegal immigrants to pay for education, health care, and buy their home for them, that's when I stop feeling so "generous".