[ivox3]

I'm good-- thanks, I'm partially insane trying desperately to not be in or out, ...here nor there, high or low.

Just trying for an exquisite transparency to life's problems. ...but, sort of failing. ...unless I'm not.

[Hervé]

you're the best Chris..

This year coming, I'm gonna develop my "ubiquity" side..

[aitraaz]

But until humans who are selfless, giving, conscious of their true role in nature, and not paralyzed by all-encompassing fear outnumber what we have currently walking around in majority, I'm going to continue calling it what it is... What it's been since human history began to be written, how it was yesterday, today, and how tomorrow's shaping up to be. And that's a lot of things; God's Special Creature sure as shit isn't one of them, no matter how many iPods we make.

"What the final deterministic constraint that is the capitalist relation ultimately determines its global death. The virtual pole of capitalism turns out to be no less suicidal than fascism-paranoia, though in a very different way - by virtue of its success, not because of an irresolvable contradiction endemic to its dynamic..."

worker/capitalist
consumer/commodity

[Frances]

Thank you Chris! I can breath and swallow again.

I prefer to let bitterness consume itself.

[rogerteddy]

ants kill each other... but shure you are right!

rog!

[Mihai]

Far from defeatist, my disappointment in my fellow humans is directly proportional to what I feel is our unrealized potential.

Aah, good This is what I was trying to get to. The potential of the human race. You say you won't admit that humans are in most ways superior to the other lifeforms on this planet, yet you admit that we also have the greatest potential. Whether that potential goes towards good or bad, I'm not so interested in. I'm trying to get past the disappointment phase. Should I instead be dragged down by disappointment, to the point where I don't have the strength left to see and encourage this potential towards good?

This is not arrogance, I'm showing less arrogance here than thinking humans are in fact worse than animals. You should first explain what you mean by "better"? I said that by more evolved I ment we have the most effective brains. Didn't mention anything about worse or better. Having this potential, we have produced some amazing things, much more complex than any other lifeform on this planet.

You would have no feelings of remorse killing a fly that's bothering you, yet you would have if you killed say a dog. So somewhere in there you also must have this scale of value for life in general. IMO this scale of values is derived from the complexity of that life form. Humans are the most complex life here, and the one with the most potential. That is the potential superiority, whether it is used for good or bad, that's another question.

I'm being apologetic to human nature because I point out what humans do is not unique to humans? I mentioned painting, singing, sculpting. Again, this is not unique to humans either, plenty of animals do it too, just in a much less evolved and complex fashion and they do it mostly out of instinct, to attract a mate. But we are the only ones that can comprehend morality, perhaps one of the virtues that can help us evolve from our basic nature.

Which is it? You don't want to place humans in a special category, that would be human centric, yet when talking about the bad, you place humans in a very special category.........? What I'm saying is humans don't have a special "bad" gene, but because of our enormous potential we affect this planet in ways which no other animal can, good and bad. Fear of the unknown, territorial instinct, whether it's your house, or neighbourhood, gathering...stuff, these all stem from other animals. The human race as a whole has perhaps not evolved enough, that's the problem. So why put yourself in a dead end thinking?

[Mihai]

Mike, one more thing

The religious fanatic assumes that humans are nothing but bad, that must be heavily controlled so as to try and live as much as possible as an imaginary supreme being, that can do no evil. Anything less than the supreme being is unacceptable, a defect, a disease. If they are not heavily controlled, the human will destroy himself and others.

Do you agree with this view?

[michaelplogue]

Humans are in a special category - it's called sentience.

[Hervé]

Bravo Mihai.... fact is indeed that we progressed too fast compared to what our genes can cope with...

basically, all men are born equal on earth, but then some start to drink... hehe

we all come from stars... hehe... was it a song by moby.. dick.. hehe..

ahhh life is still nice... a little pain... a great pleasure.. I went to see my dentist this morning for my annual cleaning.. I hate that.. but now I 'm happy again..

Real question I fear is... should have we killed Sadam Hussein..?

[Thomas An.]

Unfortunately, most of humanity lives in the 'now' and for the most part, really dosen't care squat about the long-range consequences of our actions. We squander limited materials to make fancy foam packages to put our hamburgers in, or cut down a forest of trees so everyone and their mother can have a copy of the New York Times. We drive five miles to the Quicky-Mart on the other side of town in order buy a six-pack of beer (that could be bought at the shop two blocks from home for fice cents more.

Great words there Mike ! (great words)

[Hervé]

human race has something animals dont.... it's called leniency... but very few people uses..

[Hervé]

Unfortunately, most of humanity lives in the 'now' and for the most part, really dosen't care squat about the long-range consequences of our actions. We squander limited materials to make fancy foam packages to put our hamburgers in, or cut down a forest of trees so everyone and their mother can have a copy of the New York Times. We drive five miles to the Quicky-Mart on the other side of town in order buy a six-pack of beer (that could be bought at the shop two blocks from home for fice cents more.

Great words there Mike ! (great words)

hamburgers
New-york times
Quicky-mart

... American people go too fast.. hehe.. and Europe follows right after..

taking care for the people in 100 years is good, but taking care for the ones already here is in my sense more urgent..

but I guess going to space, making wars and economic disorders comes first..

[lsega77]

Unfortunately, most of humanity lives in the 'now' and for the most part, really dosen't care squat about the long-range consequences of our actions. We squander limited materials to make fancy foam packages to put our hamburgers in, or cut down a forest of trees so everyone and their mother can have a copy of the New York Times. We drive five miles to the Quicky-Mart on the other side of town in order buy a six-pack of beer (that could be bought at the shop two blocks from home for fice cents more.

Great words there Mike ! (great words)

hamburgers
New-york times
Quicky-mart

... American people go too fast.. hehe.. and Europe follows right after..

taking care for the people in 100 years is good, but taking care for the ones already here is in my sense more urgent..

but I guess going to space, making wars and economic disorders comes first..

What greater role hath man then to venture into space and colonize planets to eventually make war over who gets to build the first quicky-mart in space, allowing us here on earth to read about it in the New York Times.

See... it all ties together

my 2cents... we're all fucked up. 'nuff said'



Luis

[houchenk]

I like cheese.....

[Hervé]

I like cheese.....

me too... I love Basque cheeses, goat cheese, camembert, swiss cheese... so many... but king is parmesan cheese !