[aitraaz]

Yeah, i mean, let's try and cut back a bit on all the wanking going on here...

Some like the simplicity of the beta mat editor. Some like the complexity of the v1 mat editor. Both are valid opinions. Juan has stated that NL will take note in order to optimize and improve it. No need for insult. Fuck...

[Maximus3D]

It's dangerous to take eiter side in this heated discussion without being torn to pieces on other forums for your positive opinions...

Honestly i cannot see what the fiery arguments for something even simpler than the current materialsystem is all about, if it would be any simpler than it currently is then it would take away all the fun and the power of Maxwell. Hell i'd probably quit using it then as it looses all it's power, multilayered shaders really helps bring dull boring models to life again. Don't try to turn this into some fanboy chant now because it's not!

With the materialeditor you don't have to add a gazillion layers to get a good looking shader, two is more than enough for a complex good looking material, i never use more than two layers.

So try asking for actual help on how to create this and that surface if you're uncertain how to do it and we will try to help and recreate it as best as we can, i know i will. All this crybaby type babbling ain't gonna help you guys get your materials done any faster or better. Try to be constructive and to actually do something or ask for the help you need.

/ Max

[JDHill]

'I preferred the Beta's simplicity.'



'The Beta stifled my creative nature.'


_______________________________________________

...hi aitraaz.

[Eric Lagman]

I also think it doesn' t get much simplier than it is other than the Mat wizard, which they said was going to be improved. I think they are giving us the best of both worlds so I dont know what all the arguing is for really.

I will say this though, that the quality of work I have seen being put out is not as good as people were doing in the beta. Its really to early to make a call yet though whether it is people grappling with the different way of doing materials, or that the quality of the engine has degraded. I just can't say for sure yet.

We need to work as a community to come up with some cool materials together and help each other figure this out instead of having page after page of ranting. Please make suggestions, and I will give it a try to see what I can get. I dont have a lot of spare time on my hands, but maybe someone who does can set up a material challenge thread. I always need to use brushed metal, so I am going to give that a shot, and post the mxm to share if I can get something decent. Actions speak louder than words.

[Frances]

deleted

[hyltom]

We need to work as a community to come up with some cool materials together and help each other figure this out instead of having page after page of ranting. Please make suggestions, and I will give it a try to see what I can get. I dont have a lot of spare time on my hands, but maybe someone who does can set up a material challenge thread. I always need to use brushed metal, so I am going to give that a shot, and post the mxm to share if I can get something decent. Actions speak louder than words.

I'm agree with you Eric. By the way, I'm working on a brush metal as one of my customer want to have such feeling on his product. I already spend half day to setup it and one night to get an ugly rendering...I will try again today but i don't know where I'm going. For sure if all the community work together we can get something decent in no time.

[Mihai]

Do you have a photo reference to the kind of material you're looking for?

[hyltom]

Yes, wait few minute and i will show you.

EDIT:



To be more exact, the material used is some stainless steel or some aluminium.

[smeggy]

My 2 cents.

I find Predefined materials, like prebuilt scenes helpful as they are good for reverse engineering to see how a particular look is achieved. I know that having a 'wood' material will not cover every type available, however, it is *always* useful to help in understanding how something is put together. I personlly hate reading manuals, I frequently glaze over while reading them and not a lot goes in. I much prefer experimenting and reverse engineering shaders and the like as a way to learn. I think this is what many are looking for, as well as a more simplified editor, and by simpler I mean more intuitive, less technical for those of a more artistic bent. Most are after a 'look' not a physics lesson.

People like me are not very technical, we work largely on intuition and counterintuitive programs drive us nuts. What seems simple to some can be totally cryptic to others. Zbrush is a good example of that, very quick and powerful for those who understand it, totally mindbogglingly unintuitive to those who don't (like me despite having the program, manual and tutorials).

Just because some find it easy, don't assume everyone has the same mindset. I find Lightwave annoyingly awkward for the same reason. Some programs just make more sense to some people than others. It's not because they're stupid, stubborn, unwilling to learn, they just find it counter to what they percieve as common sense in terminology, methodology or whatever. This being the case, as much info, examples, tutorials and explanations as are needed to get it across would be appreciated by many.

Unless you have a firm understanding of the foundation principals, practice will get you nowhere as you will still be operating blindly. Without sufficient info people will never 'get it' and as you've all seen from these posts, a lot of people are in that very situation. Getting snippy, defensive, abusive or technical isn't going to help. You cannot brow-beat info into someone. If people are having difficulty understanding, then obviously they are not getting the info they need in the way they need it. That needs to change.

[Richard]

...yes, and once you learn the materials, you can build one. It doesn't take long and it's not difficult. It's not a good idea to have no understanding of how they work anyway. No one "magic leather setting" is going to work for all leathers. Ditto for plastics, metal, etc. If you have a library of 50 different aluminum settings, by the time you get through trying each of them out, you could've written the correct one from scratch, probably without looking. You can program a fresh, awesome aniso brushed aluminum that behaves accurately in about 30 seconds, less time than it took to post this stupid reply.

_Mike

Well I and many other users must be freakin idiot's, someone asked the question of me on an arch forum the other day, "Have you noticed that almost no renderings from V1 have been posted?".

It was plain and bloody obvious to me, I want to produce a shader for a brick of any particular type what do I do, watch a tutorial, none there, ok I'll read the manual - plastic, hmm? I've search the forum "Brickwork" - Results:

"Since the release of V1 I've been bashing my head against the brickwork tring to get materials right!"

"I've been bashing my head against the brickwork tring to get materials right siince the release of V1!"

"Mate if someone doesn't explain how to get these materials right in V! I'll end up bashing my head against the brickwork!".


I reckon this just about sums it up!

[RonB]

I agree with Smeggy, I am technically challanged in some ways. Being more in the intuitive operating mode, always have been. Even when making my living for 12 years as a high fire glaze and clay body specialist...and that is a very technical field. Even so I am having an extremely difficult time with the Material editer...I appreciate the info but as many have suggested, examples of various materials to take apart and study would go a long way.
Cheers, Ron

[Joedex]

Right on Smeggy....I don't think I could have said it any better myself.

[Richard]

Maybe the need is then for MORE TUTS!

After all what is the use a five people a day asking you how to do brushed aluminium, it is a basic, cant once armed with a basic we create or manipulate these basics for our own purpose?

Basic tuts, basic materials will at least give a start to a new user, we aren't all designing christmas trees!

If it is so simple for so many A team guru's to produce such great shaders so fast how about filling up the MXM library of the forums with some more of your talented work so we can at least explore how good this new version is instead of slagging others who just don't seem to grasp it as clearly as you! We all have talents for different things, I'm not going to drag you up a 1000ft cliff face and say come on cry baby keep up!

These threads get lost and searching here for the right info generally just gets unanswered questions! Maybe tuts in the tuts section being complied and formatted as tom has started is the best resourse for all.

[rickyinmotion]

Always agree with you all.
A soooo looonnnng thread for this simple conclusion :
1. Some tuts for basing materials settings
2. A good material database for tweaking.

[arch4d]

sorry, don´t wanna hijack this thread, but

btw, does anyone know a good setting for stained glass ? (or brushed glass, don´t know how to call it in english...)

i know rendertaxi did a good job on that one with the beta.

like this one:




mine looks this way, and i am not satisfied after 16 hours coop 2xdual xeon 3.6:



material settings:


please help me...
tried with ags because of the well known light through dialectrics prob...