[polynurb]

Hi Jeremy,

to keep you updated i just "forward" the question i posted on the NG:

i guess there is still no way of showing anything else than channel 1 in the viewport or?

in rhino render the button in the texture dialog is greyed out.

and when using my standard renderer,maxwell, i don't see any changes in the viewport either when setting a secondary mapping-channel.

i am wondering why it is still missing..? it is important form serious rendering work, and it has to work for plug-ins as well not just for rhinorender.

daniel

curios to hear how this problem presents itself on your side.

thanks,

Daniel

[JDHill]

I confirm that I don't see any way of showing a mapping other than channel 1 in V5. Here is the standard test for this, which works as intended on V4:

1. Draw a box.
2. Add a planar and cubic mapping.
3. Create a material.
4. Assign two textures in the material.
5. Set texture 1 to use channel 1.
6. Set texture 2 to use channel 2.
7. Select texture 1: planar mapping is shown in Rhino viewport.
8. Select texture 2: box mapping is shown in Rhino viewport.
9. Select texture 1: planar mapping is shown in Rhino viewport.

In V4, the only way I know (except for the above steps) of showing a particular mapping in the viewport is to change the value of one of its parameters; that appears not to be the case with V5 at the current time (I am on 5.1.20711.924), so I am only able to view the channel 1 mapping.

[JDHill]

Okay, I just installed the July 25 build. In my test scene, my cube no longer has any mappings in Obj Props > Texture Mapping. However, it does have texture mappings, because switching between textures in the plugin (or changing a given texture's channel) switches the cube between the planar and cubic mappings I had previously assigned to it.

[polynurb]

Hi Jeremy,

i just installed the "RC1" rhino build, and noticed as described here that for rhino materials multiple mapping channels are now shown correctly in the viewport.

i am also noticing some other strange behavior with maxwell in that new build, for example when i make a new file>plane>new material with two textures(eg.ref90/ref0) when i switch between the texture slots, the viewport is not updated automatically; i only see the texture once i rotate/pan.

However, when i open an old file, things still behave as expected..?!

are you seeing any of this?

cheers,
daniel

[JDHill]

I probably can't tell you much at this point. Here, switching between two textures in the plugin switches between them as expected in the Rhino viewport -- IF -- advanced texture preview is disabled. If those two textures use two different channels, though, and the object has two mapping channels, switching between them (or changing the Channel of one of the textures) does not switch the active texture's mapping into the viewport, as I have been able to do in V4. The whole viewport rendering area of Rhino is changed in V5, and I'll just have to re-work things once we don't have a new build to deal with every week.

[polynurb]

Hi JD,

i need to bug you about this once again, as multiple mappings are basically still dis-functional in terms of viewport display.

i learned to handle it, but it needs ugly workarounds in order to place textures correctly which should be on a secondary channel.

probably you don't get too many requests for fixing this, but it is a pretty integral part to a rendering workflow, and if it wasn't so painful as it is now i would use multiple mapping channels more often.

i just made another test scene and it does work fine with rhino materials, also after i switch back to maxwell as render engine, but still no chance with an mxm, at least i haven't managed.

another limitation, not directly concerning mapping channels, are OGL texture stacks.

rhino correctly displays a color map clipped by an alpha at the same time.

atm. the maxwell plug In will only show the textures isolated;
in fact there is some very strange behavior when objects with multiple mapping channels are invloved.. i managed to display a texture on an object from a mxm material that was NOT assigned to it. (the objects were copies of each other)

i hope this features can be addressed without too much hassle, it would really help in the workflow.

i mailed you the scene with the funny texture display going on. if you play around a bit (selecting different textures, changing the two materials, changing texture channel assignment...) you should see some oddities in the viewport.


thanks!

daniel

[JDHill]

There are still some bugs, which I've reported, and which have not yet been addressed. If, from code, I set a texture to use channel 2 (in the Rhino texture, I mean), it is successfully set in the document data, but not necessarily in the UI or the viewport. Behavior is also erratic depending on combinations of factors: whether the Rhino material UI has yet been created, whether the 3DM in question was written with Rhino 4, whether you are using Advance Texture Preview, and perhaps some others I am forgetting now. If for some reason you feel like reading, you can find my report here.

That aside, though, I think I should clarify it is not the plugin's intent to show you multiple textures from a material at the same time in Rhino's viewport. The intent is that when you click a texture button in the plugin material editor, that texture will be shown on objects using that material, and it will be shown using the UVs defined on the Channel for that texture, whatever they may be. So if you have the same map in refl0 and refl90, but each uses a different Channel , then clicking between the refl0 and refl90 texture buttons should switch between the two mappings in your viewport. As far as an entirely wrong texture showing on an object, that sounds like an OGL issue, either on the side of Rhino or of your adapter -- the plugin tells Rhino to use a texture the same way you do, by giving it a path, and is not involved any further than that.

Lastly, if you are switching back and forth between engines, you may find what may seem to be unpredictable behavior, because Rhino stores texture mappings per-renderer. So mappings created when Rhino Render (or another) is current are not the same mappings you see when you then make Maxwell current. Since this is not exactly obvious, and since I do know Rhino Render's ID, as a fallback, if I find no mappings associated with the Maxwell plugin ID, I do check to see if there are any with Rhino's, and use those if there are. It's not technically correct to do that, but it leads to less confusion, in my opinion, and does not affect behavior when you are using the system as it is designed to be used.

[polynurb]

Hi JD,

any promising stories from this front yet?
as the NG is closed now and the last post is long time ago i was wondering how this comes along.

It is frustrating that a v4 feature is still not working, and i know this is still probably not even in your control.

daniel

[JDHill]

Not really -- as far as I've seen, the current situation is that if you have, say, three mappings on an object, you can only view the second and third while you are actually adjusting them with the mouse.

[polynurb]

when i open a new file and

- leave all viewports in a non rendered view mode

- draw a plane

- assign two projectors.

- make material assign it, and use textures with both uv channels (1,2 )

- setObjectDisplayMode on the plane set to rendered.

- works


- set any other viewport to rendered: does not work any longer.





i have been following the course of this issue for a while but can't tell anymore what really is the cause, limitation or if it is a never be possible thing because of the rhino sdk.
It is just 2 years ago, and if it will never work, it would be good to know.

it is a feature i need fully operating, i have been using hacks/workarounds for too long now, but switching a few seats to other software is a decision not taken easily.

i'd be happy if you could shed some more light onto this.

thank you,

daniel

[JDHill]

If you mean you need to be able to see a particular (let alone multiple) projection the viewport, there's not much I can tell you that I haven't already. In V4, when you click a texture in my material editor, or change the Projector number of the currently-selected texture, I can successfully force Rhino to show you the projection for that texture's Projector number, but in V5, this has had no effect, or at least not any consistent one. Which seems understandable, since as I pointed out in the previous post, it doesn't appear there is any way in Rhino itself to say which projection you'd like displayed in the viewport: except when you are actually changing a projection parameter value (e.g. click+dragging the UVW offset > U value) it appears to come down to which is first or last in the list, apparently depending on whether advanced texture preview is enabled, or which projector was last edited, or some other similar but ultimately unknown factor. In any case, once you are done changing the value, it goes back to showing whichever projection it wants.

In other words, I think you are asking me for a feature not supported by Rhino itself, and which may only have worked in V4 due to implementation details. To see what I mean another way, just do this:

1. Set Rhino Render as current.
2. Draw a cube.
3. Go to Obj Properties for the cube.
4. Click the Material tab and switch on Assign material by: Object.
5. Assign a color texture.
6. Click the Texture Mapping button and enable Use multiple mapping channels.
7. Add a cubic projection.
8. Add a spherical projection.
9. Try to tell Rhino to show the spherical projection in the viewport.

As far as I know, it can't be done -- the only time you'll see the spherical projection is when you are actually changing the value of one of its parameters, in which case a white & grey UV map will be shown interactively. Once you stop editing the value, you'll once again see the cubic projection. I think what is needed, and is currently missing, is just a way of saying which projection we're interested in seeing; it could be an integer spinner in the texture mapping page, indicating the index of the projection to show, or a mutually-exclusive checkbox on each item in the Channels list (in other words, similar to how you manage the current layer in the layers panel), or some other mechanism.

[polynurb]

working fine here. as soon as i change the channel of a texture, it is displayed accordingly in the viewport.
it is also possible to display a combination of projectors at once as in image 3.
i do see some inconsistencies in the display pipeline, if switching between rendered modes with advanced texture preview and without (it will only display correctly if ATD is on): sometimes it won't revert to the proper display and i am not sure about the setps to restore correct display. but the possibility to display things correctly is certainly given.
I never work with rhino materials, so i haven't looked how buggy things are in that area..

asfaik, it has been somewhat working like that for rhino materials for a good while.
rhino thread

[JDHill]

Indeed, you are correct (provided advanced texture preview is enabled). I guess when writing that, I mixed up what is possible using the UI with what is possible using the SDK, since I mostly think in terms of the latter. Going back to the test plugin I wrote for the McNeel people (can't find reference to it anymore, as it was posted on the plugins newsgroup, which is not archived anywhere I can find, but I spent a lot of time putting together a very detailed example, with code), I find that apparently, nothing has changed. What that plugin showed was basically this behavior:

• 1. enable advanced texture preview
  2. Make a new Maxwell material, assign one texture to refl0 on channel 1, and another to refl90 on channel 2.
  3. draw a cube and assign the material.

At this point, you should be able to switch between the two textures by activating either one in the Maxwell material editor. Next:

• 4. Add a cubic mappping
  5. Add a spherical mapping

At this point, you can no longer switch between the two textures using the Maxwell material editor. Next:

• 6. disable advanced texture preview

Once again, you can now switch between the textures using the Maxwell material editor. However, you'll notice that the mappings never change, even though the two textures are on different mapping channels. Next, check that the plugin is doing what it is supposed to:

• 7. select the refl0 texture in Maxwell
  8. in Obj Props > Material, uncheck "Plug-in"
  9. edit the Color texture
  10. note that the mapping channel is set to 1, as expected

Next:

• 11. Dismiss the Rhino texture editor
  12. check "Plug-in" again
  13. in the Maxwell material, select the refl0 texture
  14. again un-check the "Plug-in" box in Obj Props > Material
  15. edit the Color texture
  16. note that the mapping channel is set to 2, as expected

Now re-enable advanced texture preview, and repeat steps 7-16; in this case, you will notice that not only will the mapping channel set in the Rhino material be ignored, but so will the texture path itself. Literally, when you un-check the "Plug-in" box, you'll see the name of your texture shown next to the Textures > Color checkbox in Rhino's material editor, and it will be correct, but it will be a different texture than is seen on the object in the viewport.