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Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 2:28 pm
by ptaszek
Hello Maxwell team,
Do you have any plans to support Metal GPU rendering in the near future?
Best,
Mac

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:12 am
by luis.hijarrubia
Developing a GPU engine is really hard. We want to improve the current one and implement the missing features before starting a new one.

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:26 am
by pjmc377
Octane and Redshift are already developing their renderers for Metal in light of the fact that Apple dropped Nvidia and Nvidea will no longer support Cuda on Mac.
If Maxwell wants to slip even further down the list than they have, they will ignore this as they have other things.
I for one will move to redshift or Octane if Maxwell slips behind again, and Maxwell has been my main renderer since its Beta days.
Apple are very influential in what they support and don't support. remember when they dropped Flash while every website was using it ? how many flash websites do you see today ? none. I hope Maxwell doesn't fall behind the curve again.

“OTOY is incredibly excited about the all-new Mac Pro and how it will empower our users. Octane X — the 10th anniversary edition of Octane — has been rewritten from the ground up in Metal for Mac Pro, and is the culmination of a long and deep collaboration with Apple’s world-class engineering team. Mac Pro is like nothing we’ve seen before in a desktop system. Octane X will be leveraging this unprecedented performance to take interactive and production GPU rendering for film, TV, motion graphics and AR/VR to a whole new level. Octane X is truly a labor of love, and we can’t wait to get it into the hands of our Mac customers later this year.” — Jules Urbach, CEO and founder, OTOY

Maxon
“Tapping into the amazing performance of the new Mac Pro, we’re excited to develop Redshift for Metal, and we’re working with Apple to bring an optimized version to the Mac Pro for the first time by the end of the year. We’re also actively developing Metal support for Cinema 4D, which will provide our Mac users with accelerated workflows for the most complex content creation. The new Mac Pro graphics architecture is incredibly powerful and is the best system to run Cinema 4D.” — David McGavran, CEO, Maxon

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:36 am
by pjmc377
luis.hijarrubia wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:12 am
Developing a GPU engine is really hard. We want to improve the current one and implement the missing features before starting a new one.
So you want to lose another two or three years ? haven't you already fallen behind the pack enough ?

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:35 pm
by dmeyer
pjmc377 wrote:
Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:26 am
Octane and Redshift are already developing their renderers for Metal in light of the fact that Apple dropped Nvidia and Nvidea will no longer support Cuda on Mac.
If Maxwell wants to slip even further down the list than they have, they will ignore this as they have other things.
I for one will move to redshift or Octane if Maxwell slips behind again, and Maxwell has been my main renderer since its Beta days.
Apple are very influential in what they support and don't support. remember when they dropped Flash while every website was using it ? how many flash websites do you see today ? none. I hope Maxwell doesn't fall behind the curve again.

“OTOY is incredibly excited about the all-new Mac Pro and how it will empower our users. Octane X — the 10th anniversary edition of Octane — has been rewritten from the ground up in Metal for Mac Pro, and is the culmination of a long and deep collaboration with Apple’s world-class engineering team. Mac Pro is like nothing we’ve seen before in a desktop system. Octane X will be leveraging this unprecedented performance to take interactive and production GPU rendering for film, TV, motion graphics and AR/VR to a whole new level. Octane X is truly a labor of love, and we can’t wait to get it into the hands of our Mac customers later this year.” — Jules Urbach, CEO and founder, OTOY

Maxon
“Tapping into the amazing performance of the new Mac Pro, we’re excited to develop Redshift for Metal, and we’re working with Apple to bring an optimized version to the Mac Pro for the first time by the end of the year. We’re also actively developing Metal support for Cinema 4D, which will provide our Mac users with accelerated workflows for the most complex content creation. The new Mac Pro graphics architecture is incredibly powerful and is the best system to run Cinema 4D.” — David McGavran, CEO, Maxon
To be fair, flash died because iOS didn't support it (and other issues), not because OSX didn't support it.

Apple certainly sounds very excited about their efforts to resurrect their line of pro machines, and metal support sounds great. At this point its just announcement-ware though until we actually see strong, shipping support from software vendors. I'm old enough to remember when OTOY told us OpenCL was the path forward.

The "pro 3d on mac" market is pretty tiny as it is.

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:44 pm
by feynman
Apple still makes computers?

Last I looked at their 10-K annual report, I thought it is the largest overseas bank that also sells mobile phones, apps and entertainment?

:mrgreen:

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:58 pm
by luis.hijarrubia
I'm not interested in a Mac vs other systems war. But I was working webpages when flash died, and from my point of view, flash died because HTML5 with CSS3 was so good that wasn't needed any more. You could do any animation on the page itself, no need for a third party plugin, send people to install it before running the web, no black box of code on your website, no more huge vulnerabilities on windows. Apple helped that the transition was faster as they stopped supporting flash. But we were already moving there.

The case of graphics I see it complete contrary. We all hope for a standard on gpu computing, but it doesn't seem near. Nvidia won't let amd or intel implement CUDA, that is the best library. OpenCL is almost dead, apple didn't upgrade it on mac for 8 years or something like that. And metal is only mac, so is like you need specific implementation for each system, and that's somethimes too much for small companies. And let's not talk about mantle... Maybe vulkan is the future altough is more raster graphic oriented than gpu computing.

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 8:32 pm
by T0M0
And what about CPU engine ?
It is still in development (new features, optimization, making it faster) or are you mostly focused on GPU now ?

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 8:39 pm
by ptaszek
T0M0 that’s very good question. I also would like to know it. CPU it is still more stable option especially in automotive where you need to render 20-40mln poly and more just for a car. I am also interested in CPU since latest Mac Pro offers high core count options or maybe one day switching to Windows + inexpensive threadripper (I hope not) ;)

Re: Metal Support for GPU Mac rendering?

Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 12:47 am
by luis.hijarrubia
T0M0 wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 8:32 pm
And what about CPU engine ?
It is still in development (new features, optimization, making it faster) or are you mostly focused on GPU now ?
Well, more than if, is when. If we plan new features, now we think about doing them for CPU and GPU, it make non sense to make engines more different. Optimization first step than can improve CPU engine is on preprocess, voxelization... That will make better both worlds. A future option for me (and I recall for me, it's not anything planned yet), it to make CPU code (and I mean code, not algorithm) more similar to GPU one. That would make code easier to fix, mantain and make new things, and probably will make code faster on systems with lot of cores.